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Where do you fit?

February 25, 2004 | Comments 29 Comments

This will be a bit of an experiment. I might be fun, or it might turn into a big mess. Either way I think it’s very timely in light of all the discussion going on lately about form vs. function, aesthetics, design and the rest.

I got a question in my FAQs section the yesterday from a woman named Amy Gray that I thought might be fun and interesting to open up to all of you.

Amy’s question reads:

There has been quite a bit of discussion lately on various issues that I personally find interesting. Many of the issues in question, “Form vs. Function”, for example aren’t a matter of one or the other, more like how much of one vs. how much of the other. I’ve noticed in some of your comments you tend to fall into the middle sometimes. So, here is my question.

Rate yourself and you style against against the following extremes, in terms of percentage and regarding Web design, etc. I realize some of these aren’t mutually exclusive, but give it your best shot. Feel free to elaborate.

  • Designer/Developer
  • Form/Function
  • Front-end/Back-end
  • Print/Web
  • Web standards/Not-Web Standards
  • Minimal/Complex (or Lush)
  • Content/Presentation
  • CSS/Tables
  • Flash/HTML

Below are my answers. If you feel so inclined, please add your own, or just fire away.

  • Designer/Developer. 75% Designer.
  • Form/Function. I don’t feel you can have one with out the other, but for the sake of answering this question I’d say I fall around 70% Function.
  • Front-end/Back-end. 85% Front-end and moving upwards.
  • Print/Web. I rarely do print work any more. 95% Web.
  • Web standards/Not-Web Standards. I do my best to work with Web standards, but there are times when I stray, so, 85% Web standard.
  • Minimal/Lush. I assume you mean design style here. I think I lean toward the Lush a tad, but it depends on the project. I’ll say 65% Lush.
  • Content/Presentation. Depends on the project. But in general — 70% content.
  • CSS/Tables. I try and avoid tables for layout whenever possible. 80% CSS.
  • Flash/HTML. I don’t do much Flash work anymore, but I still can work with it well. I’ll say 80% (X)HTML.

Filed under: Web General

Comments

1. Scrivs said:

Designer/Developer: 95% Designer. Getting back into developing though.

Form/Function: 50%. Lame I know, but hey.

Front-end/Back-end: 100% Front-end. Some backend starting soon.

Web standards/Not-Web Standards: 90% I would say.

Minimal/Lush: 100% Minimal :-P

Content/Presentation: 70% Content

CSS/Tables: 100% CSS. I ain’t no sissy like Keith ;-) Of course I also don’t do the sites he does.

Flash/HTML: 100% HTML.

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:13 AM | #

2. Derek said:

My Answers

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:21 AM | #

3. Todd said:

Designer/Developer: 95% Designer.

Form/Function: 65% towards form (for the time being)

Front-end/Back-end: 100% front-end, although I want to learn more back-end work.

Web standards/Not Web Standards: 40% right now (still learning)

Minimal/Lush: 50% right now. Depends on what day it is.

Content/Presentation: 80% presentation

CSS/Tables: 50% CSS for right now

Flash/HTML: 100% HTML. Haven’t used Flash in over a year.

That pretty much exhausted me.

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:21 AM | #

4. Gabe said:

  • Designer/Developer: 50%. I totally oscillate between the two in terms of my focus.

  • Form/Function: 80% Function. Pure form has its place, but I prefer more concrete goals.

  • Front-end/Back-end: 65% Back-end. I like the control afforded by back-end programming. So many of the common CSS quandaries and debates on hacks -vs- validation can be solved incredibly elegantly in the back-end.

  • Print/Web: 99% Web. I can do print work if I have to, but I don’t have much experience with it.

  • Web standards/Not-Web Standards: 60% Web Standards. I really like standards a lot, but I’m a pragmatist, so sometimes I let things slide.

  • Minimal/Lush: 55% Lush. In practice I think minimalism is more practical for sites on a budget or with a lot of information to present, but in my heart I aspire to lush designs.

  • Content/Presentation: 51% Content. They both enhance each other, I say they are equally important, but I generally espouse the view that a website should have some content, so i’ll give it the slight edge.

  • CSS/Tables: 65% CSS. CSS is great for layout when it works, but there are still some things that tables do better, and I won’t hesitate to use them when things get hairy. On the other hand, CSS can do a hell of a lot of things that tables can’t, and that’s where I think the advocacy should begin; not some ivory tower notion of semantic purity.

  • Flash/HTML: 99% HTML. I own Flash, but have never used it. I’ve got a freelance project coming up where I’ll be doing the back-end coding on a band’s Flash site. I’m sure I’ll get sucked into the ActionScript and maybe even some of the design. Actually I hope to do more Flash work in the future as a creative outlet and easy introduction to animation concepts.

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:31 AM | #

5. Roger said:

  • Designer/Developer: 30/70
  • Form/Function: 20/80
  • Front/Back: 75/25
  • Print/Web: 0/100
  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 100/0
  • Minimal/Complex: 70/30
  • Content/Presentation: 80/20
  • CSS/Tables: 100/0
  • Flash/HTML: 0/100

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:36 AM | #

6. Chris Vincent said:

  • Designer/Developer: 55/45.

  • Form/Function: Ditto Keith.

  • Front/Back: Eh… It all comes together in the end, right? 50/50.

  • Print/Web: 25/75

  • Standards/Not Standards: 95/5. Sometimes I use hacks that don’t validate. :P

  • Minimal/Lush: 40/60. I’m making a transition right now to more elaborate designs.

  • Content/Presentation: Really depends on the project. In most cases, these are independent of one another.

  • CSS/Tables: 99/1.

  • Flash/HTML: 0/100. I’ve been meaning to try some Flash stuff out… I’ll probably have it and HTML working together, rather than one or the other.

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:45 AM | #

7. MJH said:

* Designer/Developer: 30/70 ( I spend a lot of time designing, but i’m not good at it. )

* Form/Function: 20/80

* Front/Back: 25/75

* Print/Web: 0/100 ( i dont even own a printer. )

* Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 100/0

* Minimal/Complex: 80/20

* Content/Presentation: 50/50 (Does presentation include Usability??)

* CSS/Tables: 100/0

* Flash/HTML: 15/85 (and 99% Java)

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:46 AM | #

8. Nick Finck said:

  • Designer/Developer: 40/60

  • Form/Function: 50/50

  • Frontend/Backend: 95/5

  • Print/Web: 0/100

  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 100/0

  • Minimal/Complex: 100/0

  • Content/Presentation: 90/10

  • CSS/Tables: 90/10

  • Flash/HTML: 5/95

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:50 AM | #

9. Paul G said:

  • Designer/Developer: 35/65

  • Form/Function: 40/60

  • Frontend/Backend: 50/50 - Lots of PHP fun. Mmm.

  • Print/Web: 0/100

  • Standards/No Standards: 85/15 - the 15% is due to my day job, where they’re pretty much impossible to use, otherwise it would be 100/0.

  • Minimal/Complex: 75/25 - I like complex designs, but I suck at them, so I stick with minimal as much as possible. :)

  • Content/Presentation: 50/50 - I agonize over both.

  • CSS/Tables: 85/15 - Again, work requires it.

  • Flash/HTML: 0/100

Posted on February 25, 2004 12:00 PM | #

10. Ruben said:

  • Designer/Developer: 20/80
  • Form/Function: 20/80
  • Front/Back: 50/50
  • Print/Web: 20/80
  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 75/25
  • Minimal/Complex: 90/10
  • Content/Presentation: 80/20
  • CSS/Tables: 99/1
  • Flash/HTML: 0/100

Posted on February 25, 2004 12:08 PM | #

11. Mark Hurd said:

  • Designer/Developer: 70% Designer

  • Form/Function: 80% Function - no point in it looking good if you can’t use it at all

  • Frontend/Backend: 90% Frontend, but that slowly drops week by week

  • Print/Web: 99% Web, again, slowly changing

  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 80% Web Standards, and getting higher with each new client

  • Minimal/Complex: 50%, I like to change it up

  • Content/Presentation: 80% Content

  • CSS/Tables: 95% CSS

  • Flash/HTML: 100% HTML

Posted on February 25, 2004 12:38 PM | #

12. Jeremy Flint said:

Designer/Developer - 85/15

Form/Function - 50/50

Front-end/Back-end - 70/30

Print/Web - 5/95

Web standards/Not-Web Standards - 60/40 (i say this only because we still have some sites we maintain that have not been converted to standards-compliant sites yet)

Minimal/Complex - 60/40

Content/Presentation - 70/30

CSS/Tables - 60/40 (see web standards/non-standards)

Flash/HTML - 10/90

Posted on February 25, 2004 12:40 PM | #

13. Bob said:

  • Designer/Developer: 40/60

  • Form/Function: 30/70

  • Front-end/Back-end: 40/60

  • Print/Web: 5/95

  • Web standards/Not-Web Standards: 90/10

  • Minimal/Lush: 75/25

  • Content/Presentation: 35/65

  • CSS/Tables: 90/10

  • Flash/HTML: .05/99.95

Posted on February 25, 2004 12:55 PM | #

14. Keith said:

This is kind of fun, I’m glad I did it.

Looks like Roger changed Minimal/Lush to Minimal/Complex. Gives a bit of a different feel to that question….But then again I guess you could be Minimal and Lush at the same time, so maybe it’s better.

If that is how people are going to interpret it, I’ll change my answer to 95% minimal. “Work smarter, not harder”, “Keep it Simple Stupid” and all that.

Posted on February 25, 2004 01:00 PM | #

15. Lea said:

Designer/Developer: 95/5 (Always and forever)

Form/Function: 60/40 (I would have liked it to be 50/50… but reality doesn’t dictate that)

Front/Back: 99/1 (I know only basic .htaccess and little PHP stuff)

Print/Web: 55/45 (It’s crazy, but they really are almost equal.)

Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 85/15 (Recent stuff, standards as much as possible. But for work, I still have to weed through someone’s old table work…)

Minimal/Complex: 50/50 (Seriously–it depends on the project/client/audience)

Content/Presentation: 60/40 (It’s gotta have a balance… but a tad more emphasis on content is key)

CSS/Tables: 85/15 (See answer for web standards/not)

Flash/HTML: 10/90 (I’ve done a little Flash things… I need to learn more)

Posted on February 25, 2004 01:27 PM | #

16. Michele said:

  • Designer/Developer: 70% Designer, but it’s shifting towards 50/50.

  • Form/Function: 50%.

  • Front-end/Back-end: 80% Front-end.

  • Print/Web: 100% Web.

  • Web Standards/Not-Web Standards: 90% Web Standards.

  • Minimal/Lush: 70% Minimal.

  • Content/Presentation: 60% Presentation. I reckon my content needs to be worked on more.

  • CSS/Tables: 100% CSS, both for personal and work projects.

  • Flash/HTML: 99% HTML. I really need to pick that Actionscript book up and make something good out of it.

Posted on February 25, 2004 02:06 PM | #

17. Marcus said:

* Designer/Developer: 50/50

* Form/Function: 50/50

* Front-end/Back-end: 50/50 - Slowly moving towards the back-end, like it or not…

* Print/Web: 0/100 - icky print. it’s too ‘real.’

* Web standards/Not-Web Standards: 10/90 - I know.. this needs to change.

* Minimal/Lush: 40/60

* Content/Presentation: 80/20

* CSS/Tables: 5/95 - Again, this is changing. Fast. No. I mean it.

* Flash/HTML: 50/50. At home it’s HTML, at work it’s Flash.

Posted on February 25, 2004 04:44 PM | #

18. feather said:

  • Designer/Developer: 10/90. Because I can.

  • Form/Function: 50/50. Because I try.

  • Front-end/Back-end: 20/80. Because I eat.

  • Print/Web: 0/100. Because I didn’t.

  • Web Standards/Not-Web Standards: 100/0. Because I believe.

  • Minimal/Lush: 80/20. Because I can’t.

  • Content/Presentation: 80/20. Because I learn.

  • CSS/Tables: 99/1. Because I separate.

  • Flash/HTML: 0/100. Because I don’t.

Posted on February 25, 2004 04:53 PM | #

19. mattymcg said:

  • Designer/Developer: 30/70. That’s my background but I am trying to move more toward the design stuff.

  • Form/Function: 30/70. No matter how pretty it looks it has to work. If you go about it right it’s easier to improve form once function is in place, but harder the other way around.

  • Front-end/Back-end: 30/70. Again this is changing as I become more interested in front-end stuff.

  • Print/Web: 0/100. But would like to try my hand at print some point down the track.

  • Web Standards/Not-Web Standards: 70/30. (cringe) This is based on my work up until now, not how I feel about it. Only having learnt about web standards recently, I plan to reverse this completely from here on in.

  • Minimal/Lush: 60/40. Prefer minimal personally, but the client often dictates this.

  • Content/Presentation: 40/60. Being able to write I usually get roped into creating with more content than I would like.

  • CSS/Tables: 70/30 up until now. 1/99 from here on.

  • Flash/HTML: 10/90. But would like to learn more about Flash and how to implement it while keeping things standard and accessible. This midpoint I think is tougher than just using it to its full potential and disregarding accessibility.

Posted on February 25, 2004 07:16 PM | #

20. Lukasz said:

Designer/Developer: 60/40. Design is a large part of my day-time job.

Form/Function: 0/100. I don’t care how it looks provided it is functional.

Front-end/Back-end - 90/10

Print/Web - 0/100, I never print my works, no matter of what type they are.

Web standards/Not-Web Standards - 90/10. I know how to use XHTML, but never really cared about XML and other things.

Minimal/Complex (or Lush) - 100/0. Minimal as it’s more clean and functional. Connected with other points.

Content/Presentation - 90/10. Also, is connected with points above.

CSS/Tables - 100/0. No tables. I don’t know even how to use/customize them.

Flash/HTML - 0/100. I don’t use flash and never will. I even have flash plugin turned off in my browser for I don’t really care about eye-candy button animations.

Posted on February 25, 2004 11:25 PM | #

21. Phunky said:

Hehe, this sure will be fun ! heres mine…

# Designer/Developer : 75% Designer

# Form/Function : 75% Function

# Front-end/Back-end : 80% Front-end

# Print/Web : 95% Wev

# Web standards/Not-Web Standards : 99% Web Standards

# Minimal/Complex (or Lush) : 50/50

# Content/Presentation : 50/50 depends on project

# CSS/Tables : 99% CSS

# Flash/HTML : 100% HTML, As i disagree that Flash is good

Posted on February 26, 2004 01:26 AM | #

22. Andri Sig said:

# Designer/Developer 25/75

# Form/Function 50/50

# Front-end/Back-end 85/15

# Print/Web 0/100

# Web standards/Not-Web Standards 99/1

# Minimal/Complex (or Lush) 75/25

# Content/Presentation 50/50

# CSS/Tables 90/10

# Flash/HTML 10/90

Posted on February 26, 2004 01:30 AM | #

23. Aaron Schaefer said:

  • Designer/Developer:85/15

  • Form/Function: 15/85

  • Front/Back: 90/10

  • Print/Web: 05/95

  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 95/05

  • Minimal/Complex: 85/15

  • Content/Presentation: 80/20

  • CSS/Tables: 100/0

  • Flash/XHTML: 0/100

Posted on February 26, 2004 08:44 AM | #

24. Tom Trenka said:

Oh, what the hell.

Designer/Developer: 45/55

My primary function for employment is as a developer, but I focus on UI development. And design is somewhat of a strong hobby for me.

Form/Function: 35/65

While function is king for me, the realization that good form reinforces good function, I’d have to say that form is indeed very important in what I do.

Front/Back: 25/75

Mainly because I can do the back end really really well…so that’s what I get paid to do.

Print/Web: 05/95

Mostly Web, but I have done *some* print.

Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 80/20

I try to follow the standards as much as possible, but an awful lot of the development I do is aimed at IE web applications, at which point standards go right out the window (mostly in using IE proprietary methods, and many many more tables).

Minimal/Complex: 60/40

I like both approaches, but only when they are called for.

Content/Presentation: 60/40

Like the form vs. function debate, so the content vs. presentation.

CSS/Tables: 75/25

I’m not above using tables for the initial grid…and when there simply isn’t another way without major workarounds. But only for layout purposes.

Flash/XHTML: 5/95

I’m not a big fan of Flash, but I’m not an opponent either. Right tools for the job, right?

Posted on February 26, 2004 10:29 AM | #

25. Jennifer said:

  • Designer/Developer: 80% developer. Got the degree in CS, and I mostly develop the front-ends of Java web apps.

  • Form/Function: At work, about 85% function. In my free time, 70% form.

  • Front-end/Back-end: Depends on what perspective you’re looking at it from. A designer would probably think I was 75% back-end, but a programmer would think I was 75% front-end.

  • Print/Web: 99% web. Once I designed the CD label/insert/case for a disc of a couple of my concerts. Several family members have copies.

  • Web standards/Not-Web Standards: 75% standards, moving quickly towards 100%.

  • Minimal/Lush: I really like looking at minimal design, but I think I have a tendency to create somewhat more lush stuff myself. So, 50/50?

  • Content/Presentation: Isn’t this pretty much the same as Form/Function?

  • CSS/Tables: Trying to get away from tables, but still using them for work (both for tabular data and some layout). So, 70% CSS.

  • Flash/HTML 100% HTML. I’ve never used Flash, though it might be cool to learn sometime. Also 100% Java.

Posted on February 26, 2004 11:12 AM | #

26. Lars said:

  • Professional/Amateur: 0/100

  • Designer/Developer: 70/30

  • Form/Function: 100/100

  • Front/Back: 70/30

  • Print/Web: 20/80

  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 100/0

  • Minimal/Lush: 90/10

  • Content/Presentation: 80/20

  • CSS/Tables: 100/0

  • Flash/HTML: 0/100

Posted on February 26, 2004 11:44 AM | #

27. Ben said:

Designer/Developer: 40/60

Form/Function: 50/50

Front/Back: 30/70

Print/Web: 10/90

Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 100/0

Minimal/Lush: 80/20

Content/Presentation: 80/20

CSS/Tables: 100/0

Flash/HTML: 30/70

Posted on February 26, 2004 01:34 PM | #

28. scottbp said:

  • Designer/Developer: usually 40/60 but at my current job about 10/90, which is beginning to bug me

  • Form/Function: 100/100 form and function merged, for me it is all about the same thing, like one of those circular scales, go far enough along and you get back to the beginning

  • Front/Back: 90/10 I have fiddled with various backend technologies in the past, but I am just not that interested

  • Print/Web: 05/95 yeh, I’ve done print but for the last few years I have worked for big-ish agencies that have print departments…

  • Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 100/0 having said that I believe in following web standards but that doesn’t mean I always can. Example being a recent development where we were using .net and all the stuff being spit out was very UN-valid. But I always aim for maximum validity. I just do not cry if a site is a little invalid when we can’t much help it.

  • Minimal/Lush: 80/20, but they aren’t totally mutually exclusive

  • Content/Presentation: 60/40 there was one dude above (lukasz? can’t find it now) who said something along the lines of “I don’t care how it looks as long as it works.” well for it to work for me it must be well designed.

  • CSS/Tables: 100/0 I had to fix a sub-contractor’s work recently and I was all like… how do I do this tables stuff again?

  • Flash/HTML: 20/80 Used to be more flash but then I got into web standards a couple of years ago… I love flash and all it can do, I just get frustrated with all the tyros out there.

Posted on February 26, 2004 06:58 PM | #

29. Carol said:

Designer/Developer: 40/60

Form/Function: 30/70

Front/Back: 75/25

Print/Web: 0/100

Web Standards/Not Web Standards: 80/20

Minimal/Complex: 50/50

Content/Presentation: 23/85

CSS/Tables: 90/10

Flash/HTML: 20/80

Posted on July 26, 2004 03:28 AM | #

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